Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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I've been studing Steve Jordans drum parts with the original Blues Brothers band.. and man that guy is an awesome drummer! He has agreat way of putting great grooves together with great chops. The one thing I'm not sure of is this - he plays fantastic ghost note grooves.. for example in Messing With the Kid, it sounds like fast accented 8ths with the left.. or in another tune he breaks into fast straight triplets with the left. They are super smooth quiet ghost notes.. and it's a live recording so I'm assuming no overdubbing. Also the ride pattern is cooking with his right at the same time.. so I'm trying to figure out:
= is he doing this with finger control? It almost sounds too fast and perfect for this but he could be superhuman Lol!
= or is he covering the ride with his foot on the hats and alternating both his hands between the snare and cymbal?
I have searched Youtube and haven't found any examples of him doing finger control type ghost notes like this.. but I'm sure he's capable.. what an awesome drummer! Has anyone seen his video or seen him play live doing anything like this?
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Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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Well.. I wish I could point you to the tracks I'm talking about to get some opinions. Ghost notes can sometimes be hard to decipher when buried in the mix. Also I think I figured out what he's doing.. there's a bit of a n optical illusion type of effect that makes it sound like he has three hands.. but I think he's at times playing rudimental type grooves with the left hand that blend in so well that they sound like continuos notes. Other times he's swapping his hat hand to whack the snare on the backbest so again it sounds like continuos notes.
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dlm513
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Apr 15 2006
Posts: 135
Loc: Rhode Island
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He has a dvd out called the Groove is Here. He is my favorite drummer for groove. The dvd shows alot of stuff like that in it.He does alot of work with John Mayer also.
http://www.vicfirth.com/artists/jordan.php
The list of stuff Steve Jordan has played on is endless. Deffinitely one of the best pocket drummers out there. 
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Always looking for the rhythm in everything I do..
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Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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Cool - I hadn't seen that clip.. the stuff on the main clip is not too mysterious to me.. but great groove.. reminds me of a Billy Cobham groove I lifted many years ago. The clips on Youtube don't do it any justice - as the ghost note stuff gets lost in the low quality audio. The original recordings are so much better. Here's an example of what I'm talking about:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plaDFJpOfMs
If you scroll to around 2min 30 sec.. in the clip, you can barely here it, but in the background, it sounds like fast straight triplets on the snare in the background.. then on top of that he's got the ride, crashes, HH and snare backbeat going at the same time. Maybe an octapus is playing? I can come close to the sound of what he's doing, but on the original recording it sounds so smooth - it's perfect!
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Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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My best guess is this;
- he's playing two hands on the snare for the quiet roll / sharp accented triplets
- he's playing 1/4 notes on the hats with his foot, but it sounds like a ride.. so he may be quietly splashing it with his foot - or maybe its the HH cymbals he's using or the way it was picked up on the mics makes it sound like a ride.
- he chirps the HHs once in a while or hits a crash with his right hand which doesn't detract from the triplets on the snare so it still sounds continous.
All in all it creates a pretty cool sounding 'audible illusion' and really drives the band. I've noticed he does stuff like this a lot..or variations on it.. like playing a ghosted ruff on the snare with the left and alternating the HH and snare backbeat with the right i.e., RllRll etc. but splitting the hands like:
(R-hh)(l-sn)(l-sn)(R-sn))(l-sn)(l-sn) repeat (at fast tempo it's a continuos snare triplet except for one beat)
Here's another example of some pretty hot drumming by Steve Jordan..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR12YE9YEr8
he plays a jump-swing type double shuffle at the beginning then breaks into a triplet shuffle with the left hand on snare (playing offbeat triplets), a swung ride on the cymbal with the right and a driving shuffle pattern with his kick.. and its so smooth and dynamic - just awesome.. Too bad the sound quality is so trashy.. if you can dig up the original recording it's much more impressive.
Edited by Tea Bag (Mon Jun 06 2011 10:00 AM)
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Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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Here's a question for Roger.. probably one of the most knowlegable shufflers out there..
Steve Jordan throws in a lot of 2-handed shuffles on the snare from time to time (i.e Flip Flop Fly among others).
I haven't heard many other drummers do this for blues shuffles (well maybe Zyedaco or 2nd line stuff).. but It just occurred to me.. at the time he made these recordings.. Steve Gadd was the hottest guy around and he often did those 2-handed military style rudimentary grooves on the snare.. and Steve Jordan was an 18 year old kid who was the up and comer.. there's a youtube video where he talks about his big break where he got called to play a big gig with Steve Gadd and later got hired to do SNL from a producer who was in the audience. In any case, I wonder if that influenced his shuffle style.. or does the 2 handed snare shuffle go back to some era I've never heard of?
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roger strange
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Dec 09 2003
Posts: 1650
Loc: Nova Scotia Canada
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The two-handed shuffle goes as far back as Sid Catlett and Baby Dodds as well as Zutty Singleton. Long before there was even a hi-hat stand and certainly no ride cymbals. One of the nicest modern versions of a two handed ridless groove shows up on one of the segments in Tom Igoe's instructional CD course where he uses that "not straight and not triplet" New Orleans style shuffle in the left hand and the floor tom as the riding surface. There are dozens of those kinds of shuffles and Jordan has known about those babys since he was a kid. Probably grew up with them around him as a kid.
Most of them are influenced by the 3/2 clave rhythm but I've heard Levon Helm pulling them off straight years ago with the Hawks. And he's originally out of the Arkansas travelling minstrel type rhythms. Technicaly I suppose it's about how you use the rebound in the rhythms and although I use them a lot at times I can't even explain them in writing. They have to be seen and heard. Tom Igoe has pretty well nailed down how this stuff comes about in his DVD and as far as I'm concerned that DVD and set of card charts and book are about the best thing out there for any player to get hold of. It's no wonder the cats out of North Texas are as good as they are! Tom's been with the drums since birth. His Dad is Sonny Igoe. One of the scariest and finest drummers of the 30s, 40s and 50s to walk this Earth.
Edited by roger strange (Thu Jun 09 2011 03:36 AM)
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Tea Bag
Tiger Talk Pro
Reged: Sep 16 2004
Posts: 1423
Loc: Canada
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Yes.. I've seen the Igoe stuff online; he really does an excellent job of demonstrating the 'groove essentials'. I picked up his poster chart somewhere along the way, either in a drum mag or a music store. Great stuff!
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